Sure they will. Since it is infinite and non repeating, It is presumed that pi has every sequence of numbers imaginable, meaning that if you came up with any random 50 numbers, somewhere in the string of pi they would exist making tastymeatpie's comment extra clever. The only part that would incorrect is that since there is no end to pi, there is no middle.
I think this is a common misconception. Sort of like saying a million monkeys mashing the keys of a million typewriters for a million, or even an infinite, number of years would eventually produce the complete works of Shakespeare. No. No, they would not. Just because something is infinite and non-repeating it does not necessarily follow that it must contain every possible pattern.
Sure it does. You realize just how long infinite is right? Furthermore, the link you provided proved my point - "However, if the decimal expansion of π contains every possible finite string of digits, which seems quite likely, then the rest of the statement is indeed correct. Of course, in that case it also contains numerical equivalents of every book that will never be written, among other things."
I must have missed that comment amid all the many others that said the exact opposite. And yes, I understand what infinity means. 50 numbers isn't that long, though, so.. you're probably right about it containing any random string of 50 numbers. probably. But the binary equivalent of Pride and Prejudice? Highly highly highly unlikely. Even stretched out to infinity.
If you took ten balloons filled with paint and threw them in the air and watched how they landed, they would make different patterns of color every time. If you did this an infinite number of times, would you eventually get the Mona Lisa? No. Never. Same with the monkey thing. Monkeys typing on a keyboard might produce a lot of random letters. But you will get a lot of variants of "agvaelnhvke" and "a l er kjehv " and "artraegav"... but never once "To be or not to be, that is the question"... it just wouldn't happen. Not even with an infinite number of tries. The probability is effectively zero.
According to that stackexchange link you posted, it is expected that every possible string of numbers can be found in pi. It just hasn't been proven. But you're right the chance of finding a random 50 digit string is effectively zero unless we develop new methods of calculating digits of pi.
That's the beauty of infinity. There is no such thing as "effectively zero" probability. Stretching a limit out to infinity, probability becomes either 100% or 0%. Using your balloon example, you couldn't release an infinite number of balloons with an infinite number of colors and end up making a cake because the media are different, therefore probability = 0% even over an infinite time period. However, when typing, including letters and common punctuation, you have a one in say 35 chance or 2.86% chance to hit a certain letter. To accidentally type the word "Hamlet" that probability drops to .0000000544%. So yes, typing an entire novel would be an unfathomably low probability, but not zero. Over an unfathomably long (infinite) time period, any nonzero probably becomes 100%.
Well I'm not a mathematician but it was my understanding that even if the numbers never repeat at all they still are unsure if there aren't some sort of patterns that could emerge given enough computational power. Such patterns could preclude there being a string of 1s and 0s (binary) trillions of digits long appearing anywhere in the sequence. But... shrug... not my field of expertise.
I believe the theorem suggests that it will 'almost surely' happen, not that it will. On each individual keystroke there is a 1/26 chance of a particular letter being chosen (ignoring punctuation, spaces and whatnot for simplicity's sake and assuming each letter is equally likely). There may be a 1/17576 chance of getting a particular three character sequence, but if chance has already produced two characters in sequence, the chance of then getting the third remains 1/26. In other words, we are talking about an infinite sequence of 1/26 chances, which means there is a chance, however unimaginably, vanishingly small that you could end up (technically, you wouldn't 'end up') with simply an infinite line of 'q'.
I think that as kalbahamut has stated it, the 'Mona Lisa' scenario is not equivalent to 'digits in pi'. Suppose we rephrase it like this: "imagine an infinitely large number of pixel arrays, each of arbitrarily large but finite size, and each happily of the same aspect ratio as the Mona Lisa. Suppose each of the pixels in each of these can be any one of an arbitrarily large but finite number of colours. In an infinite number of randomly colour-filled grids, would any of them resemble the Mona Lisa, as closely as resolution and palette allows?" I think the answer to this question is "yes".
Every possible finite sequence of digits in pi is conjectured to come up eventually. This is equivalent to saying that pi is what is called 'normal' when written in any base. This means that if you go far enough there will be an equal proportion of each of the digits. So statistically a 1 and a 2 are just as likely to come up. But the conjecture is that this doesn't just work if the digits are in base 10, it works if they are in any base. This has been proven to be true of most irrational numbers, but it is very hard to prove that it is true about any specific irrational number. "Just because something is infinite and non-repeating it does not necessarily follow that it must contain every possible pattern". This is undeniably true but consider the example with the monkeys. There are 41 characters in your quote. Assuming there are 100 possibilities for each character (there would probably be fewer) this gives far less than 10^100 possibilities.
Some of these possibilities will have to repeat infinitely many times because the monkey would run out of new possibilities for sequences of 50 characters to write. So if it never typed your quote, it would be typing some sequences of 50 letters infinitely many times and others never. This seems extremely unlikely and indeed is (unless of course there is bias towards some combinations, for instance of the monkey preferred to type the same letter many times in a row). This is why the monkey will almost certainly type your quote eventually.
However this does not apply to infinite sequences. The probability of the monkey typing an infinite line of 'q' genuinely is 0 and so will almost certainly never happen. We are dealing with the infinite here so having a probability of 0 doesn't mean it is impossible. It just means that whatever probability you care to name greater than 0, the infinite line of 'q' will be less likely than that.
The number 0.112122122212222122222... is irrational (and so is infinitely long and non-repeating), but contains no digits other than 1 and 2. Infinitely many such numbers do not contain any particular finite string of numbers, though many more do.
The chance really doesn't have to be all that much over zero to make it appear in an infinite set of numbers. I don't think the concept of infinity is being grasped quite correctly here. The numbers go on forever without repeating at any point, meaning that each extra digit is essentially random. This means that in any given set of 50 numbers, there is a 10 to the 50th power chance that it is the exact set of numbers that you guessed, which just isn't all that high when you have infinite possibilities in which it can happen.
there is a 100% something will happen as long as it's possible in an infinite universe, fx there is a 100% chance there is an exact copy of the earth if the universe is infinitely sized.
This is only true under certain conditions. If we assume that there are infinitely many particles in the universe, the percentage of the space they take up is greater than 0%, that they are arranged randomly, that space is discrete and that the earth contains only finitely many particles the probability is 100% in an infinite universe. But many of these assumptions are likely to be false, most notably the random arrangement of particles and the infinite size of the universe.
Infinite doesn't mean that it contains every pattern. The number of one-third is 0.333333333333333333333333333 etc. It is infinite but doesn't contain every possible pattern.
1/3 is rational and therefore has a recursive decimal expansion, so it can't contain every possible finite string of decimal digits. Pi has been proven to be irrational so its decimal expansion isn't recursive, but it has not been proven to contain every possible finite string of decimal digits (though pretty much no mathematicians think that it doesn't).
@kalbahamut, for every comment I have seen you write, there is one thing that I've learned about you: That you always think differently and are ready to prove your point, no matter how much other people disagree.
I'll take that as a compliment with the caveat that, while I'm ready to argue any point that I've thought through, I'm also always willing to change my mind if someone is willing to engage me and prove me wrong. Most people don't like to engage, though, which is disappointing.
Response to kal's comment: "while I'm ready to argue any point that I've thought through, I'm also always willing to change my mind if someone is willing to engage me and prove me wrong. Most people don't like to engage, though, which is disappointing." Semper necessitas probandi incumbit ei qui agit. If you make a statement, it is your job to prove it, not to job of others to disprove it.
You mean I should prove that it is upon you to prove a statement. That concept is enshrined in many countries' legislatures including the United States, it is generally seen this way in philosophy and stated in Hitchens's razor: "What may be asserted without evidence, may be dismissed without evidence." q.e.d.
But my stating that it is enshrined in american law, etc. is evidence of the truth of my before statement, thus making it a statement which needs evidence to be dismissed.
Just because it is an infinitely repeating irrational number does not mean that it will have every possible pattern. Some numbers just follow a strict pattern and only pass certain ones places. For a simple example, divide 100 by 3. 33.3 repeating is infinite, so shouldn't it pass every number pattern? No.
The only way to prove there are any pattern of 50 digits is to find them in the list of the known digits of Pi.
Nobody knows if every pattern is inside Pi digits, and the infinity isn't a proof at all as long you have not proved the Pi digits don't follow a law...
Imagine you have the following number : 0.12345678910111213141516... an infinite number where you just add the next integer and so on.
Then you decide a rule where there is never a "2" after or before a "3" (if it occurs you just remove the "2"), the number you obtain is infinite too but you'll never get any random 50 digits in it, since 50 digits with "23" ou "32" in it will never be.
I didn't get that many. Remembered some from "Cosine, secant, tangent, sine, 3.14159. Integral radical mu dv, slipstick, sliderule, MIT!" which I apparently have stored in my memory banks.
I think some people have made it to all 50 but, two things, a) the statistics only tabulate data on people's first attempt. If they make subsequent attempts and do better it doesn't affect the stats. and b) it could be that fewer than 1 in 200 people gets past the 39th place, which would mean fewer than half a percent, but still some people. I'm not sure if the stats round down to 0% or not, but I assume that with all the people who have taken this before at least one person has stopped the timer or looked up pi and cheated their way to a perfect score on their first attempt, even if they couldn't do it from memory, so I also assume that the stats must round down if it's a number less than 0.5%
18/50 I'm 12 and we do not study pi at all in math class... When I am finished with a test I usually have like 20 mins left I just stare at a pi poster and memorize.. About a week now and I know 18 😀
The way I remember the first few digits after the decimal point (141592) is through the sentence "I wish I could calculate pi", in which the number of letters in each word match the digits :)
You couldn't have, one a two year old most likely wouldn't be able to remember all the digits, also the percentages for the last couple of digits are 0% because nobody had completed it yet, I highly doubt a two year old could type that quickly, you would need to type like 3.5 digits a second to finish in time. Even if you are two you shouldn't brag about it
How I want a drink, alcoholic of course, after the heavy lectures involving quantum mechanics, and if the lectures were boring or tiring, then any odd thinking was on quartic equations again. :)
I knew 296 in a fifth grade competition, and I could have gone quite a bit farther if I hadn't forgotten a short section (~5 numbers). Maybe overall I knew around 360... I HATE THOSE 5 NUMBERS obviously...
Needless to say I got first. The previous record was 52 which is kind of sad...
Typing or speaking? Because if I'm speaking them it takes me 5-6 seconds, which is literally as fast as you can go while still being able to (mostly) distinguish each individual digit being said.
I went to Australia and they said that when they come here to USA, we show them our history, and take them to museums and stuff, but when we visit them, they take us to the beach. :D
Australia: one of the few places an American can go and not feel like his own country is a little short on history.
Serbia: ripped-off at the border. Unfriendly people. Dreary boring cities. Then upon attempting to exit had my car and the love of my life the past 14 years stolen from me without reason by corrupt border cops. Tried to get it back but even providing all the evidence that was asked for to prove the car was legally registered, the kangaroo courts there didn't want to return my stolen property. What a pathetic excuse for a country if they have to resort to outright theft of tourists' property to fund their anemic economy.
I think it used to go up to 200 when I originally made it. The idea being that you could test yourself to see how many you could get in 15 seconds with no upper limit.
When QM decided to feature the quiz he cut it down to the first 50, so that it was at least possible to ace the quiz and get 5 points.
I got 17 on my first try, and I'm 11. Huh. Note to self: MUST TRY HARDER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :):):):):)
Every time someone comments on my quizzes I get a notification. Once in a while I'll miss one but not often. I don't usually get more than one or two a day.
Though this is no longer accurate you can make custom time limits. But I don't want to change it. However, if you wish, you can copy this quiz in the quiz editor and make your own version.
3.141592653589793238462643383279502884197169399375105820974944592307816406286208998628034825342117067982148086513282306647093844609550582231725359408128481117450284102701... MEMORY IS GR8
what is wrong with you people! i knew that energy equals mass times the speed of light squared before einstein was even born and i DEFINITELY knew the digits of pi when i was in the bleeding first grade! all 852 digits. what? you didn't think that the digits of pi eventually stopped? that's propaganda for you. scientists say that pi has an infinite amount of digits but it was actually a complex hoax invented by hitler in 1939 that would trick the minds of the jewish scientists like einstein. so pi actually has 852 digits and you can find the records in any public library. also pi is a palindrome, which most people don't know since they think it has infinite digits. also if you graph a circle with the exact 852 digits the circle will become such a circle that the human eye is tricked into seeing a shape with 3.1415(...) sides. which of course is impossible and therefore any calculator or other method of graphing is dysfunctional when it comes to graphing the real pi digits. peace out yo
If you say "to (e.g.) 3 decimal places" you generally would mean decimal places after the decimal point. But I agree that the first 3 should count. If you say "to how many decimal places do you know pi?" I would not include the 3 in my answer, just the decimal places after the decimal point.
I did it with 0:08 seconds left. First time I got 0:01 seconds and second time 0:07 seconds. At first I didn't realize you only had 15 seconds to do it then half way through I realized you gotta type fast. (I've been playing pi runner for a year now and can type very fast on the number pad (: )
This is just your personal opinion. I am very offended by how in every quiz you write, you take the opportunity to be offensive to Christians. If you weren't so far left you would have different answers to most of these decimal places. Real correct answers from my POV: 3.173928902857119374729475666666666382914. Also much too US-centric. ;-)
Eventually got 50/50 at my sixth attempt - 2 seconds remaining. Can only see me possibly shaving about 3/4 seconds off that, so doubt I'll be able to get up to the 8/9 seconds that I see others are achieving (after quick skim over the comments, so not sure if anyone has left 10 seconds remaining). Well done to all those who complete this and extra kudos to the quickest - good job :)
Nice and by the way dude, I have done it with 10 seconds left, so you can mark me down. I really dont think I can do any better. I was so fast. I did not even believe it when i saw it.
buddy iam just kidding, I like your quizzes. Really sorry if I offended you. I said that comment because I used to have a name called kalbahamuz, but I soon changed it.
maybe cause they wanted it out of their untaken quizzes list? Like me. I got to the 8th digit though. That is 8 answers more than I would get to all of those NHF or whatever NFL sports quizzes that are staring me in the face in the untaken colomn...
With those, one day I might just click them and then immediately give up.. So I dont have to keep scrolling past them.
Great quiz picture. :D Those word jokes sadly don't work for Germans. :( Since i is pronounced like e and neither pie, pee nor pea are actual words with meaning here.
266 comments over pi... omg ! Not sure If I should start reading them haha. (and not even sure it is all comments, or if you click load all comments, even more comments show up..)
my best is with 10 seconds remaining. I took over a thousand tries most likely and just kept reloading the page every time i made a mistake. I feel like someone who is crazy fast typist could get one more second on me but not 2
It is possible to do it in almost no time at all if your computer is slow and doesn't start counting down immediately. I think this is probably what happened when I got the best time I ever have.
that's true i got it once with 15 seconds remaining all because the thing glitched out and didn't even start counting. But i dont count that one since it was a glitch. So my best without glitching is 10 seconds remaining. i'd like to see someone beat that.
also, if you check on the quiz info you can see the date and time taken for each attempt and how many they got. There are only 2 with 5 seconds taken and they are on the same date. Those are mine. There is one with 4 seconds taken and that almost made my heart skip a beat until i saw that only 11 digits were typed on that attempt.
Who else came onto this in December 2019 and thought "there are probably as many comments on this quiz as there are digits in pi. (I know pi is infinite, it's a joke, please be gentle. Kalbahamut is extremely aggressive when it comes to this, I don't particularly want to get bashed online.)
I can do them all in order but 15 seconds is not enough time at all! maybe make it 30 seconds because it says that only 1% of people who tried it, got to the last number
Way too easy. Make it 300 digits and then it will be a little challenging. Keep in mind I am known throughout my school as the champion of Pi memorization.
If you took ten balloons filled with paint and threw them in the air and watched how they landed, they would make different patterns of color every time. If you did this an infinite number of times, would you eventually get the Mona Lisa? No. Never. Same with the monkey thing. Monkeys typing on a keyboard might produce a lot of random letters. But you will get a lot of variants of "agvaelnhvke" and "a l er kjehv " and "artraegav"... but never once "To be or not to be, that is the question"... it just wouldn't happen. Not even with an infinite number of tries. The probability is effectively zero.
Love your quizes
Nobody knows if every pattern is inside Pi digits, and the infinity isn't a proof at all as long you have not proved the Pi digits don't follow a law...
Imagine you have the following number : 0.12345678910111213141516... an infinite number where you just add the next integer and so on.
Then you decide a rule where there is never a "2" after or before a "3" (if it occurs you just remove the "2"), the number you obtain is infinite too but you'll never get any random 50 digits in it, since 50 digits with "23" ou "32" in it will never be.
You see the point ?
Needless to say I got first. The previous record was 52 which is kind of sad...
Serbia: ripped-off at the border. Unfriendly people. Dreary boring cities. Then upon attempting to exit had my car and the love of my life the past 14 years stolen from me without reason by corrupt border cops. Tried to get it back but even providing all the evidence that was asked for to prove the car was legally registered, the kangaroo courts there didn't want to return my stolen property. What a pathetic excuse for a country if they have to resort to outright theft of tourists' property to fund their anemic economy.
that's all i know about PI and the numbers after the decimal .
Oh well. :)
When QM decided to feature the quiz he cut it down to the first 50, so that it was at least possible to ace the quiz and get 5 points.
I
WISH
I
COULD
CALCULATE
PI
After that I'm out of ideas :)
2nd try 33
That's 52%
This beats or equals 100% of test takers
The average score is 9
Your high score is 50
Your best time is 0:04 remaining
(Can anyone beat my time?)
{by the way, this is copied and pasted so its not fake}
This beats or equals 100% of test takers
The average score is 9
Your high score is 50
Your best time is 0:09 remaining
... burn?
P.S. This is officially the most number of answers on a JetPunk quiz :P
With those, one day I might just click them and then immediately give up.. So I dont have to keep scrolling past them.
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Biblical_scientific_errors#Pi
Followed by 2-6-5-3-5-8-9
Circumference over diameter
7-9, then 3-2-3
OMG! Can't you see?
8-4-6-2-6-4-3
And now we're on a spree
38 and 32, now we're blue
Oh, who knew?
7, 950 and then a two
88 and 41, so much fun
Now a run
9-7-1-6-9-3-9-9
Then 3-7, 51
Half way done!
0-5-8, now don't be late
2-0-9, where's the wine?
7-4, it's on the floor
Then 9-4-4-5-9
2-3-0, we gotta go
7-8, we can't wait
1-6-4-0-6-2-8
We're almost near the end, keep going
62, we're getting through
0-8-9-9, on time
8-6-2-8-0-3-4
There's only a few more!
8-2, then 5-3
42, 11, 7-0 and 67
We're done! Was that fun?
Learning random digits
So that you can brag to your friends
lol